Debate 3: ‘Start from your backyard’
  • Opens Saturday 19 October 15:00-17:00 (CET)
    Moderators: Rafaela Camasa (Spain), Steven Lockhart (UK)
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    HOW TO MOBILISE ON- AND OFF-LINE? If we utilise the tools we have we can maximise our impact. The question is: how can we best do this? Do you know what çapuling is? Have you been threatened with rape for expressing your opinion? Are you familiar with mini campaigning? These questions and millions more relate to organising the fight against hate speech. In this debate we’re talking in an open, online space about linking online and offline mobilisation to fight hate speech at the local level. We’re inviting you because many of you are campaigners with vested interests in effectively getting people involved! However, whether you have experience, want to share your thoughts or just observe the discussion - join us!
  • Hello all! We apologise for the slight delay..we are here to see how we can best together identify online and offline mobilisation and link them!
  • In the description upcoming to this debate we asked you if you knew what çapuling is..This video might be helpful before we start discussing how this term came up! www.youtube.com/watch?v=PLt-YfBZj3c
  • Hello, I am new here. I hope I can be of help to the discussions
  • The video doesn't explain 'chapulling' of course but it is rather an example of taking an existing word with a negative connotation, in this case 'capulcu' = looters/vandals and reclaiming it. This took place in the Turkey protests of 2013. Here is more about it.
  • Hello Le Vintage. Great to have you here, thank you for joining us..
  • To make it clear how the term çapuling relates to both mobilisation and hate speech, perhaps I can explain a little - the Turkish PM used this derogatory term to refer to those people at Gezi park during the resistance which began there. The people quickly reclaimed the term as a source of mockery for how out of touch he was with the people and their purposes. From this seemingly simple reinvention of a disrespectful comment, people found great humour and began using it as a source of unifying people where the PM had sought to divide them. In short, it is one example of things which can be used both on and offline to encourage others to engage.

    But we'd like your thoughts on ways you find effective in mobilising people, for whatever the cause. Speak up!
  • Le Vintage, do you have experience of mobilising people online or offline, or both? If so, can you talk a little about it?
  • Let's be honest, it can be very tough work to mobilise people.. even just to talk about mobilising people!
  • Steven just had a learning experience about talking on mobilisation..do you want to share? it might be useful to even consider how other people view mobilisation?
  • Haha, yeah, no problem. I am talking with a friend about joining the debate and they say that they do not believe in the discussion. They perspective is that people should work in smaller groups of 3/4, learn from one another and act accordingly.

    I disagree. I find a lot of value in what my friend says, this is a great way to work - but only on certain issues. For others it is useful to reach, impact and mobilise larger numbers. This can be done through existing networks, but these networks have their own methods of 'outreach' too. So, however you see it or 'term' it, people contact others and encourage them to get involved.
  • I'm just going to say ideas that I have, even if there's no discussion. If people read it they can think about it and decide if they agree or not...

    I think it is important to recognise that 'reach' is different from 'impact', and even that impact does not necessarily translate to people 'acting'. Often we hear organisations talking highly of their 'reach', for example, we reached 10,000 followers etc., but what does this mean if there is a call out for people to oppose fascists in their city and 20 people arrive? Certainly it is something that you can contact so many people to share your ideas etc., but are you inspiring them into action? If this is part of your aim it is not enough to focus on the size of your 'reach' or your networks.

    I want to be better at motivating others into action, which is why I'm hoping others with experiences and skills different from mine share their points of view :)
  • After the expereince with the first 6 months of the No Hate Speech Movement I strongly believe that the online mobilisation can only work together with offline actions. It is especially relevant for a campaign with strong educational aspects like ours. The online debates support these assumptions as well.
  • Referring to the point about 'mobilisation' above, if I may add you need to EXPERIMENT with other audiences. These audiences can be called secondary and they are not the ones you are already targeting. you sort of redirect and adjust your message for 'untouched grounds', or draw from existing opportunities out there.

  • I agree with the No Hate Speech Movement point above. Sometimes it is not enough to know you have 'reached' some people online, or that people liked the page. However, I think online mobilisation in terms of the Hate speech watch (reporting tool) can be of great importance.
  • Yeah, I agree with that (obviously we need to remember that 'online' is offline too, in the sense that it all in-the-world) There are 'some' examples of entirely online 'movements' but for most organisations the 'offline' is vital. With things that I'm concerned with the online works as a back-up for the offline, a support mechanism. I know this isn't true for everyone though.
  • So when it comes to evaluating No Hate Speech Movement's engagement with people, how shall we do that do you think? in terms of likes, posts, shares or something more active than that? What would that be in this case?
  • The No Hate Speech Movement is not a simple campaign in terms of comprehension. It is not an easy product, human rights is a complex idea, democracy is even more abstract so it can only work if we can reach a good level of engagement wwith those who get involved. The campaign cannot stop at raising awareness it must go deeper into learning and changing attitudes.
  • I like that idea Raf and I've bene thinking about practical ways to implement it. Let's take the example of mobilising against the EDL. Would it make sense to reach out online to existing football fan groups to build support from fans who would like to oppose fascism? Or would this be a potential disaster and backfire, giving fuel to the EDL?
  • And by specific I mean very specific such as: football fans, young businissmen, young politicians, young artists, young teachers, young policemen-women....
  • Even if it might be a potential disaster i think we should explore this possibility. I think there should be some specificity at some point, experiment with new audiences, with new formats and ideas of action. I think some possibly disengaged people in relation to the Movement might get re-inspired.
  • I totally follow you Rafaela!
  • And the debates also funtion with inviting concrete people personally for a reason with clear expectations.
  • For example "I would like XYZ to join in order to share that expereince that you have." or I would like to ask you to come to explain what you mean" or "You can come to confront your concept with us....etc
  • We cannot mobilize on the general level anymore...we must go specific and targetted.
  • Hi dears, I complitely agree with the last comments -which is to be more concreate and specific. I am also for organizing the same things meantime in the same way to have wider audience and to do the things visible for many people, its one thing to be engaged one time into the action another thing is to have specific tasks and doings in ongoing basis...
  • Hmm...so maybe we should start thinking on a task-based level. An idea I have for reaching out to other audiences is to name an event/activity something attractive for our target group but the content to be different, to be the one we want rather than what the title suggests..
  • i agree with the point that we should go specific, and also challenge ourselves into reaching out to new audiences. the campaign was never meant for my taste to be general ... because hate speech is not general :-)
  • I like your point Ruxa:) maybe that's a new tagline:...because hate speech is not general..Could be a whole new campaign!
  • i don't like inviting people for something else than what we actually intent ... it sounds a bit unfair, but i do agree that we should 'sell' it more attractively ... for example on the debates, i mobilize myself harder to debate for the sake of debate. But if i'd know the debate i am to take part in would lead to something, i.e. an action against EDL, I might feel tempted to come and debate. then its good to have times for debates, but forums are also asynchronous means of communication. Meaning these debates could be open for more than one hour... thus more inviting for more people to come in and contribute...
  • We should invite those people personally who we want to involve and contact hem personally but for such a level we will need a group of very motivated "professional" online activisits. To keep it on a volunteer level it will never get there.
  • dear community manager, let me disagree. I think we have enough experience with volunteer work and committed young people in youth NGOs to tell us that we can do a lot with volunteer work. I also think that online is means to reaching out to a broader community than the one we can invite personally. But perhaps, what we can do is open a forum discussion where we would invite all the partners, young people, etc. that have been exposed to the idea of this campaign to make a proposal of what they would like to see online. Not a general one, not giving feed-back on the overall campaign... but a simple practical idea: i.e. have a debate on freedom of expression, organising an online action to kick the ass of EDL, or making a sustained campaign to report/remove/expose the page of a racist group
  • and btw the lines, i forgot its actually fun to spend time on a forum :-)
  • Maybe what I meant is leave the title open, e.g. 'Is the far-right good or bad?', instead of labeling it bad. Maybe that would draw people of both opinions. I like the idea of having something concrete coming out of discussions/debates. this would certainly have me involved!
  • oh, one action someone pointed out to me today: http://blogactionday.org
    I think this is cool, good and educational and it reaches out to far more audiences ... perhaps this is something we could also try in partnership with them...
  • I don't agree with the categorisation 'professional' and 'volunteer'. I believe these are just labels and not real descriptions of the person behind them. For me, what would make it difficult is time, not commitment. You can be committed to a lot of different things at the same time, but do not have the flexibility and available time in front of you to execute all of them at the level you want.
  • Blog action day sounds cool.Thanks Ruxa for sharing this!
  • oh, I have another one: http://globalgamejam.org ... i have a plan for them :-), I think they should develop a game that reflects the themes of the campaign ... :-)
  • this was proposed by the session on hate speech in online games :-)
  • I mean professional in the sense that they are more strongly connected to the Campaign. I did not mean volunteers cannot be professional!
  • Blogactionday looks very inviting.
  • but moving beyond the debate on volunteers ... other cool stuff online we could learn from? i like this capulling video... tells a lot about the movement: there is political commitment, there is annonimity in it as well, there is fun and there is belonging ... how to re-create that in online...
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